Miso Market building

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

(Once again in lieu of an active porter-square community.)

I saw Miso Market has a petition to save their building from being demolished. At first I was "yeah, save this little piece of Tokyo!" Then I was "wait, it's a one-story building, it totally deserves to be replaced by something taller, ideally a whole bunch of apartments on top of a commercial level, like the Paper Source building at 2018 Mass Ave[1]". Then I was "how is a petition going to stop a landlord?"

Also I don't know if Cambridge zoning is smart enough to allow a mixed-use building to be built these days; the Paper Source one is obviously way old.

So does anyone know what the plans for the site are?

Edit: I forgot to rant about the veritable plague of one-story commercial buildings in the whole area. But there really is, once you know to look for it. Big waste of space, plus their parking lots (near T stops), plus that empty triangle at Beacon and Oxford.

[1] At least it says 2018, but it's across from the mystery church on Roseland, and before 1815 on the other side, so I dunno.

Comments

[clevernonsense.livejournal.com]

I can think of several recent mass ave development projects that are mixed use. i'm pretty sure that's the norm.

I would sign a petition to destroy that building and put in something better :)

[42itous.livejournal.com]

We were just wondering the other day about Stellabella and why that building was so empty.

I think a mixed-use building would be good there -- it'd be a great location to live, which would also increase business on the ground floor. I've definitely seen that kind of construction recently: for instance, the building where Hi-Rise Bread Co's new location is (Google Street View here: http://tinyurl.com/9c53hlm).

[surrealestate.livejournal.com]

StellaBella is re-opening Saturday at the former Knucklebones location next to Diaper Lab on Elm Street.

[42itous.livejournal.com]

Ah, good to know -- thanks!

[emcicle.livejournal.com]

I agree that a larger, mixed use building would be a nice use of space, but I suppose Miso is worried about losing their space after they just opened (or recently, anyway). It would require them to be "homeless" for months if not years with no guarantee of getting their location back. So I can see why they would be concerned and not wanting that to happen.

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I totally get that, and I'm conflicted myself, because I do like their being there (even if I don't get up to them enough), and there's a lot of other 1-story stretches whose occupants I'd miss far less.

OTOH, massive rental housing shortage.

(Hey, has anyone signed the space ATA Cycle on Forest was in? Tangent: I laughed at their "visit our new location in Concord". Yeah right, I'm a short-distance utility biker, you're dead to me now.)

(ETA: yes, some Clothware store is in at least the upper portion of the space.)

[secretlyironic.livejournal.com]

The city of Cambridge has done a pretty good job of zoning on that strip, actually-- I've attended some of the public meetings on the subject and you can download some actually-not-too-dry info about what's called the North Mass Ave Overlay District from the city's website. There are also some email lists you can subscribe to that send out occasional updates about the zoning rules and guidelines.

The goal is a walkable neighborhood, and to achieve that they have set up rules that encourage 2-3-story buildings, ground-floor retail, setbacks for higher floors, floor-area-ratio rules I don't quite understand but which seem to encourage density; they discourage ground-level parking, front-of-building parking, etc. They're also adjusting the outdoor-cafe-seating rules to allow restaurants to have outdoor seating in season even if they don't have parking.

Anyway, I don't know what the deal is with the Miso Market building, but if it's leveled and replaced, it would probably be a multilevel mixed-use building with ground-floor retail, since that's what City Hall and the zoning board are all about.

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

That's all great to hear. Thanks!

[secretlyironic.livejournal.com]

Not to say that it's a perfect set of rules, and not to say that it's always been good - There are definitely a lot of buildings on north Mass Ave that are examples of "why we have this zoning rule now." :)

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

Not unique to North Mass Ave. Somerville and Medford have a lot too. I almost cried when I saw Mystic Ave recently. Streets wide enough to easily take true light rail feeding a slew of automotive businesses. Okay, plus a produce shop, hydroponics store, and a guru.

And there's a stretch on the 70 bus going west of Central that's unbelievably sparse for a place with supposedly really high property values...

[pekmez.livejournal.com]

don't forget the takeout chicken pie place and the dunkin donuts!

Yeah. I *could* even walk over there, but then I feel like I'd get run over while trying to go buy plumbing or chicken pies. So I go there when I'm driving to or from some other errand thataway.

[georgy.livejournal.com]

And Demet's Donuts! Best breakfast sandwiches and fresh donuts around.

[ron_newman]

Did Guru move? I thought they were on Broadway west of Teele Square.

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

I don't know if you're thinking of what I'm thinking of. NE of Mystic and Harvard there's a produce shop, a hydroponics store, and further up, some actual named guru presumably running a school, not a Guru Store or something which I've never heard of.

The produce shop had bhakti yoga books near the door, which might be related.

I was on foot and mostly heading east to the river, so apart from sobbing about how many people could live there with decent building heights and density and a bus that didn't suck (13 bus lines don't suck, and I don't remember Mystic being one of them), that's the limit of my awareness of the immediate area.

[ron_newman]

I was thinking of the Indian restaurant and take-out place called Guru. It was the first thing that came into my mind when you used that word.

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

Nah, looking at Google Maps, it's this place:
http://www.gurunanakdarbar.net/1New_History.htm
A Sikh gurdwara, or worship place, actually.

I note Google Maps confirms my impression of lots of car-related businesses, notes Demet's Donuts and a firearms safety place further north, and does *not* have the produce or hydroponics stores...

[somervillesnow.livejournal.com]

Yes I hope mayor Joe's similar ideas make their way to fruition for the Somerville side of Porter.

[teko.livejournal.com]

As much as I agree that a multi-story building makes more sense there, after all the work Miso Market has done to establish themselves in that location, I'll sign any petition they've got.

[pekmez.livejournal.com]

Am I the only person who find Miso market somewhat disappointing? I expect a food store to be more full of food than their sprse racks and lots of wide-open space, and keep wondering when they're going to finish stocking up. Obviously it's intentional at this point, but they just don't compare to someplace like Reliable Market, for me.

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

They've densed up from when they first opened, but yeah it's still pretty open compared to the Asian market near the MIT museum, or an Armenian market I found in Watertown, or even Ebisuya in Medford Square. And there's not a whole lot I want to get there... but OTOH, the onigiri and bento boxes to go and the sashimi are AFAIK unique to the immediate area. Next closest sashimi I know of is, er, Ebisuya, and taking the 96 sucks IMO.

[pekmez.livejournal.com]

Too bad all the Armenians live in Watertown, I'd like an Armenian market in the greater Davis/Porter area, please! :)

I will check out their bento boxes sometime though.

[42itous.livejournal.com]

I would LOVE if one of those Armenian markets opened up in Camberville. As it is, Watertown is the destination of occasional grocery-shopping pilgrimages.

The one time I went into Miso Market, I thought it was sparse and overpriced -- but that was right at the beginning, so I guess I should give them another chance.

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

I did poke my head in, note cheaper produce prices (lower rent I assume) and buy some baklava, but why are Armenian markets awesome?

(I also noted some highly implausibly priced alleged saffron.)

As it is, they seemed to clearly be part of a whole little Armenia, what with the church and genocide memorial and posters for an Armenian street fest when I biked through.

[42itous.livejournal.com]

Things I buy when I go to the Armenian grocery stores:
- lamejuns
- cheap spices and interesting spice mixes
- unusual fruits like fresh dates or pomegranates out-of-season
- relatively inexpensive dried fruit and nuts
- baklava and sesame-seed cookies
- twisty string cheese
- muhamara
- linden tea

...now I'm hungry! :)

[teko.livejournal.com]

They've filled the store out quite a lot, added a lot more shelving, many more products, and lowered prices a bit.

[clevernonsense.livejournal.com]

Miso is somewhat disappointing compared to Reliable Market or the old Porter Exchange place, but they're still SO MUCH BETTER than anything else that currently exists in the area, so I would be sad if this shut them down.

However, this leads me to believe they signed a year-to-year lease? I mean, if they had a solid lease they'd have nothing to worry about so I think as long as the landowner is obeying the law what rights do anyone have to hold up development?

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

As I said elsewhere, I'm sympathetic to that. OTOH, I bet Tamarind House and Rosie's Bakery have their fans, or Judy Jetson and Super Fusion (ok, that's me) or the Ethiopian place (also unique in the area, AFAIK.) And then nothing improves because each local element of the status quo has its fans, yay NIMBYism.

[sparr0.livejournal.com]

This is off-topic, but I can't think of a better place to ask... Where can one find a list or map of mixed use zones/exceptions for Somerville? For Cambridge and Medford?

[nathanjw]

Somerville zoning code (look for "ZONING MAPS" in the left-hand navigation) and color map.
Cambridge zoning maps.

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

...
...
I did not know buildings could be safely partially demolished like that. Fascinating!

We can also see here the density benefit of land taxes vs. property taxes.

Even more fascinating which I have wondered about: can buildings be *extended* up while in use? I'd assumed not for lack of proper foundation and bottom support walls -- but if some of those buildings are stumps, could they at least be built back up to their old eights.

[ron_newman]

Sometimes buildings can have floors added to them. Please, if that's going to happen, let it be done in a more aesthetically pleasing way than what happend to Long Funeral Service at Mass. Ave. and Beech St.

[intuition-ist.livejournal.com]

agreed. what a monstrosity.

[clevernonsense.livejournal.com]

Oh man I love that building :)

[serious-noir.livejournal.com]

Do you (or anyone here) know the back story on the funereal building? Every time I pass it, aside from noting the monstrous, cynical design, I am struck by how shabby it looks, the cheap materials and construction decaying after only a few years.

Clearly they got some kind of zoning waiver based on retaining elements of the original building - so they retained an ugly, broken brick wall and part of the back building.

Also I have wondered if the upper floors are finished/occupied. From the outside it appears that it is some sort of loft space with 20 foot ceilings.

[ron_newman]

I remember that it caused a huge controversy among the North Cambridge residential neighbors, who said that Cambridge had violated its own zoning regulations to approve it. I don't remember the details. There may still be a lawsuit going on.

[serious-noir.livejournal.com]

I just found an article about it from 2005- the guy sounds like a real piece of work.
http://www.cambridgeday.com/2005/11/01/builder-raises-tensions-by-pushing-boundaries/

[ceo]

The Burlington Mall's second floor was added in the mid-eighties, with the mall in operation throughout.

[mindstalk.livejournal.com]

Wow, cool.
Why doesn't this happen more? I'm guessing expensive or has particular pre-requisites.

[ursamajor]

From what I understand, the building foundation has to be designed with the capability to support multiple floors from the start (and I suspect this is more expensive than a foundation designed to support a single-story building). The building Miso is in lacks that facility, unfortunately.

[ron_newman]

the mystery church on Roseland

I think that's the former 'North Prospect Church', which Lesley University bought and is turning into a home for their recently acquired Art Institute of Boston.

[beinneighe.livejournal.com]

I keep looking at the vacant lot next to the fire station where the carwash used to be and thinking "oh please, open a more affordable grocery store so I don't have to keep going to the Shaw's in Porter"....

[ron_newman]

That's supposed to become residential -- I don't remember if it's rental apartments or condos. There is a complicated arrangement between the developer and St. James Episcopal Church, which owns (owned?) some of that property.

[teko.livejournal.com]

The carwash is an awful eyesore, but there's some sort of development that the church is planning; the banner they've had hanging on the fence seems to promise that they'd tear down the carwash and build residences and/or a church extension. It's kind of hard to tell what they have planned, and it's been awhile since they hung that banner, though.