The Davis Square Community

I thought this meant Sunday Rock Band could go another hour, but apparently not.

I don't see any reason they shouldn't get the license. They're pretty much right there on the Square.

From:

ron_newman

I'm fine with it but I don't live next door. The issue for these licenses is often whether patrons are noisy when leaving the establishment and walking into the surrounding residential area.

From:

Considering it's on Holland, where Johnny D's is just steps away and both PJ Ryan's AND Rudy's are at the other end of the street, I honestly doubt it'll make much of a difference.

From:

The biggest issue for us is the noise directly outside of Orleans and on the side streets as people find their way back home. Orleans is in a significantly different situation from the other 2am licenses in the Square. None of those have residential abutters, and in the case of Joshua Tree and The Burrin, the nearest residences are blocks away. Orleans, on the other hand, has residential abutters on all four sides. They have been very good neighbors, but their patrons, not so much. We routinely have very loud arguments/merrymaking/fights in the adjacent Comcast lot, not to mention various bodily fluids against the Wallace Street wall of Davis Square Dental and the wall of the Buena Vista parking lot. I dislike dealing with it at 1 and 2 would, of course, be worse.

From:

There are residences less than a block away from both of your examples.

From:

As far as I can tell, the nearest residences to the Joshua Tree and the Burrin are on Chester and Herbert Streets, over a block away from the entrances to these establishments and certainly not next door or facing the entrance. Am I missing something?

From:

There are a couple of big apartment buildings around the corner of Grove Street and Highland Ave. This is pretty much right behind the Burren. As one might expect, patrons of the Elm Street nightlife don't head up that way too much, instead heading toward Mass Ave or back toward the Square.

I don't live as close to Orleans as you do, but the Comcast parking lot noise is quite annoying for us also.

From:

Right, I missed those but, for reasons you point out, I don't think they're functionally that close to the Burrin. The problem, as you and I both pointed out, is not noise from inside the bar itself, but from people leaving the bar or hanging around outside it. This noise tends to be concentrated near the front entrance or, in the case of Orleans, in the Comcast lot. My point was that Orleans's front entrances and the lot both open up directly onto residences while that section of Elm street is entirely commercial. No one's going out the back of the Burrin as far as I can tell.

From:

The nearest residences actually start right next to Redbones, the Burren literally has an entrance facing the street and the Joshua Tree is just around the corner. Granted, the residences at Orleans are a bit closer, but I don't think it makes a difference.

And to be honest, both the Burren and the Joshua Tree draw a rowdier crowd than Orleans (not "blood on the streets" rowdy, but Orleans is slightly pricier and more of a date restaurant meets a local watering hole, whereas the Burren and Joshua Tree are decidedly bars).

From:

At 2am, it's going to be full of Tufts students, regardless of ambiance, is my guess.

I don't know. I live closer to Johnny D's than to Orleans, and Orleans is the one that pisses me off. I think it has to be that damn parking lot.

I also hear loud thumping music coming from that direction, but it's not clear to me if that's from the establishment, cars starting up in the parking lot, or something else.

From:

closetalker11.livejournal.com

I find Orleans to be decidedly Tufts-students-free, hence its appeal (to me, anyway).

From:

Indeed, I think that's right. Tufts students cause their own set of problems on our street, but I don't think they're a major source of business for Orleans, even late at night, it's just not that kind of bar (see, for example, The Aquarium).

From:

closetalker11.livejournal.com

Hey, Orleans is MY local watering hole ;).

From:

arrowintwolakes.livejournal.com

But I do think that description is fairly accurate. Maybe with a dash of incognito sports bar.

From:

mjrocks98.livejournal.com

There was an apartment advertised this summer as being "above the Burren." I considered going to look at it, but thought if it's above the Burren I'll never get any sleep.

From:

ursamajor

Ugh. As someone who used to live half a block from the Breezeway and two blocks away from Paddy $@%$@#'s in Roxbury, both of which had 2 am closings, you and other Orleans neighbors have my sympathy.

From:

ron_newman

I'm not familiar with these two establishments -- are they similar in style and clientele to Orleans?

From:

ursamajor

Breezeway is the more upscale of the two - it's louder than Orleans when I've been there, but I haven't been to Orleans on a Rock Band night, where I would think it would be louder. They're a bit less formal than Orleans, but people still dress up clubbing-style to go there.

The second is actually Packy Connor's, not Paddy (my bad), and it's more like ... hmm, I don't know of a similar bar near Davis. It was the scene of a quadruple shooting in July, a riot in May, and that's just what got media attention; being their former neighbor (and where most of their patrons would park their cars so they could drive home drunk later), I can vouch for complaint-level noise and frequent street violence from their patrons every Thu-Sun night.

(I've got a list of a few more links about Packy's when it's come up in the news.)

From:

ron_newman

When I've gone to Orleans for Rock Band night, I haven't heard music or noise from the restaurant out in the street.

From:

You're right. What goes on inside Orleans isn't the problem at all. In fact, they're good neighbors in all aspects except for the noise from people outside and in their lot. It's quieter in the street at midnight when they're open than at 1 when they close, although disturbances in the parking lot do happen while they're still open. If they can come up with a plan for controlling noise and the like outside their doors at all hours of the night, I'd be more willing to have them open until later. I haven't seen such a plan.

From:

ron_newman

Johnny D's does have residential abutters. However, they have not (so far) applied for a 2 am license.

From:

josephineave.livejournal.com

When I saw this ...1 and 2 would, of course, be worse so near a bodily fluids reference, I thought you were making a potty joke.

From:

I wish I were that clever...

Thankfully, there isn't much #2 going on outside, but plenty of #1 and vomit, particularly during the warmer months. Most of it is directed, as I said, against the wall of the Buena Vista lot and the Wallace St. wall of Davis Square Dental, but we've had a few drunk assholes come into our side yard and whip it out over the years. It's pretty gross.

From:

avacon.livejournal.com

The corner of Irving and Holland (particularly the Irving St sidewalk
next to Mike's Hair) is regularly coated in vomit as well, to the point
that I've taken to avoiding that segment of sidewalk.

From:

rethcir.livejournal.com

Can you at least spell "Burren" right?

From:

No.

From:

I do live next door, and it's loud enough as it is. Seriously. My heart sank when I saw this.

From:

m00n.livejournal.com

Heh, I think of the comments to posts like this one every time friends from Chicago, New York, and Providence ask me why Boston goes to bed so early...

From:

bostonartist.livejournal.com

Before Orleans, a restaurant / bar called the "Aquarium" occupied that space. During the duration of that restaurants life there was a pitch battle between the proprietors and the abutting neighbors over noise, etc. Eventually the Aquarium either lost their liquor license or just gave up (I cant remember how it ended). The battle was a weekly news item in the Somerville Journal at the time.

From: