Creepy Solar Power Enthusiast Roaming Neighborhood at Night

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

Rant = ON.

I signed up with Sungevity, the solar power company and it recently went live. OK, they put a yard sign in front of my house, and I suppose that encourages strangers to want to talk to me. But why would someone ring my doorbell at 9:30pm on a weeknight hoping to ask me some questions about the system? It's not just me, right? That's kind of a weird thing to do, right?

If the stranger in question reads this board: Maybe you should leave a note with your phone number or email address instead? If you don't have any paper with you, well, you know where I live and you could always come back later.

Rant = OFF.

Before anyone asks, I paid about $2,900 upfront for a 15 year lease with no additional monthly payments. They also gave me a $500 iPad as a special promotion, so the net cost was more like $2,400. My thinking on lease vs. buy was that, 15 years from now, I won't want to be stuck with what will (hopefully) be very outdated technology.

I haven't gotten my first post-solar electric bill yet (it's due next week), but things look very promising. I've had the system live for 3+ weeks and I'm averaging over 100kWh/week. That should save me close to $100/month at current NSTAR rates which means the system pays for itself in 2-3 years.

And I swear this isn't why I wrote this post (really!), but if anyone is seriously interested in using Sungevity, please use my referral code when visiting sungevity.com. I think we each get $500 if you sign up. My code is 75403.

Comments

[ron_newman]

I added the tag 'utilities', but I'm not sure what this post has to do with 'recycling' .

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

I'm recycling the sunshine, maaan!

[kdsorceress.livejournal.com]

This made me giggle aloud. Well done!

[vibrantabyss.livejournal.com]

Glad you seem to have had a good experience with them. I have had a miserable time with them, they seem to understand flat roofs not at all.

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

Sorry to hear that. Have you had better luck with other solar contractors?

[vibrantabyss.livejournal.com]

I haven't tried any others...

[clevernonsense.livejournal.com]

I also had a really awful experience just talking to them and them NEVER LEAVING ME ALONE

[antimony.livejournal.com]

...We had a creepy solar power salesdrone come to our house (he had enough literature that he seemed likely to be legit, just failing hard at not creeping us out), but not a curious enthusiast.

[nathanjw]

I'm about to turn my system on (I went with SunRun), and I'm curious about your math. How do you get $100 from 400 kWh per month? Current NStar rates are about $0.16/kWh, not $0.25.

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

My most recent bill lists 9.6cents/kWh for delivery & 14.5cents/kWh for generation. As best as I can tell, the net meter attached to my grid provides only one metering number so I assumed I'm saving about 24cents/kWh in total. Is that wrong?

[clevernonsense.livejournal.com]

should be closer to .15 on average

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

You both seem to be including only the generation costs.

[nathanjw]

My bill (for rate A-1 residential) has 8.501 cents/kWh for delivery and 7.031 cents/kWh for generation (basic service fixed rate). Did you opt in to "NStar Green" 100% wind power for an additional 8 cents/kWh, perchance?

(NStar rate list here: http://www.nstar.com/ss3/residential/rates_tariffs/rates/rates.asp )

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

That's it! I'd been paying extra for 100% green.

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

Still, having my system pay for itself in around 6 years ain't bad.

[pywaket.livejournal.com]

I'm curious how big (in watts) the array size you have is. 100KWh/week suggests something around 4KW ((100 / 7 days) / average of 3 hours solar insolation per day). If so, $2900 is an incredible price for something that size.

[nathanjw]

The usual deal is that the company that installs it owns it, and gets to keep the various tax credits and the like that are associated with the power generation. In MA, that mostly means Solar Renewable Energy Credits (SRECs), which are usually worth more than the electricity itself - something like $0.50 per kWh last year, but only $0.20 per kWh in recent auctions this year. SRECs are purchased by utility companies, who have a mandate to have some percentage of their power come from solar. A system that generates 5000 kWh over the course of a year makes around $1000-$2500 per year for the installers, which is a pretty good return on investment on a ~$20k set of panels and electronics. For the homeowner, they get a certain amount of cheap or free power, don't have to deal with the complexities of the SREC auction market or the risks in that market (including the risk that it will simply cease to exist if the legislature so desires), and know that the installed has a continued stake in the operation of the system.

[pywaket.livejournal.com]

Ah, that makes sense. I'd forgotten about the SRECs - if the installer keeps those and the tax credits, that certainly would let them offer a lower price. Effectively, you're leasing them space on your roof to install their panels and they give you a cut of the profit in the form of reduced utility bills. And of course, they're dealing with all the annoying paperwork and maintenance of the system, which they have big incentive to keep functional. It seems like not a bad deal for homeowners who don't want to deal with the complexities of running a system, but would like the benefits.

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

What Nathan said. I didn't want to deal with all the paperwork.

Here's what Sungevity tells me is my system size:

System Size (STC-DC): 3.5 kW
System Size (CEC-AC): 2.98 kW

[pywaket.livejournal.com]

I can totally see that. Outsourcing paperwork (and also maintenance) is a good reason to go that way.

That said, I'm surprised at how much you're getting out of the system. The standard solar insolation charts show rates of an annual average of 3 watt hours of generation per watt of array size per day in our area. You seem to be doing about 50% better than that - around 4.5 wh/w/day. I'd think that this time of year, around the equinox, would be pretty close to the annual average. I hadn't noticed that it's been unusually sunny this spring. Interesting.

Anyway, even if it doesn't keep up that rate of generation and ends up being only 3 wh/w/day, it will still pay off in 9 years, even assuming NStar doesn't raise their rates (hah!).

Hope it works out for you.

[davelew.livejournal.com]

"I'd think that this time of year, around the equinox, would be pretty close to the annual average."

On the equinox in Somerville, the sun at noon is 42.4 degrees from vertical. At the summer solstice, it.s 20.2 degrees from vertical, and at the winter solstice it's 64.4 degrees from vertical. For a flat panel facing up, the summer solstice is the best time because the sun's rays are only 20.2 degree off-axis. But on a slanted roof, the equinoxes can be the peak season, since a 45-degree angle is pretty much facing the sun directly, like a horizontal panel at noon on the equator.

Basically, different angles have different advantages at different times of the year. Solar panels on a south facing roof with a 45 degree angle will be close to peak efficiency right now and in the fall.

[achinhibitor.livejournal.com]

I suppose it's possible he grew up in a non-urban area where one doesn't have to eyeball strangers to figure out if they are an assault risk.

[eileen newman (from livejournal.com)]

If you're looking for info about solar installations in your neighborhood, EnergySage.com has a great database of case studies that's searchable by zip code at https://www.energysage.com/project-search . There's a lot of info and a lot less intrusive than ringing doorbells late at night. Disclaimer: I work with EnergySage, but I thought this was a case where a commercial plug would actually be helpful.

[wobblymusic.livejournal.com]

As an update, I just got my first bill containing a full month of solar netting. Last month, my meter ran up 545 kWh. This month, the net usage was was 44 kWh. Even at 16 cents/kWh, that's a savings of over $80 this month alone. w00t!